Transcript: Well, I always stay away from that. I live in a place which has been _________ interference by . . . by others. We . . . we in the party that I represent keep to a very, very, very rigidly neutral lane. Whatever people here decide in terms of who your president is, or your Congress members are, what your government is is a matter entirely for people who live here. From an Irish perspective, of course, we’re entitled to say we want Ireland to be a part of that. And given that 46 million or so people here have their roots in Ireland, we think that should be an issue. And it’s a _________ that Ireland _________. It’s . . . it’s an illegitimate _________ into our affairs. It can be straightened out. And I’m quite sure that if a future administration decided it was in its strategic interests to encourage the British government to create conditions for Irish unity, that that would happen. So without getting involved in any of the other issues, I certainly would argue that that should be a _________. And incidentally, _________ successful foreign policy position at this time. I mean the Irish peace process in many ways helped in its infancy by President Clinton. It continues to be helped by the Bush administration. It’s a success and has worked. And it would not have worked except for Irish America and for the people who live here in the U.S.A.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: It isn’t so much America. We have to differentiate between America and the American government. But I think because this is arguably one of the most powerful . . . and for a period in our recent history, arguably the most powerful nation in the world, then it’s _________ that it uses that power and influence in a generous, and a gentle, and a mundane way and not . . . not . . . You know when I talk to many people in the U.S.A., including people in the government; and including the current president, President Bush; and President Clinton; and many, many of their advisors, that I think is the will of people here. That’s my notional view. I’m not an expert. I don’t profess to be an expert. But just . . . just my notional view is . . . is that America can be a force for great good in the world.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: You know here we are. This is being recorded in October. I’m in New York. It’s like an August day. I mean it’s bright summer sunshine. And ___________ summer. And yet now we have a beautiful, sunny period. But that . . . that has its negatives everywhere else in the world. So the environment is a huge, huge issue. But I keep coming back to this issue of global poverty that can be cured; that we who live in the west need to remind yourself that _________, and that we do have the ability . . . It’s like the great plague. __________ during the great plague by the multitudes who are dying from this disease. People elsewhere had the cure for it, but didn’t use it. Or similarly today, that there are people in the developing world who are being crippled by foreign debt; who are being crippled by the World Bank; who are being crippled by corruption in their own places; or who are being crippled by the fact that the developed world is turning a blind eye to what is . . . to what is happening. And what . . . what that means isn’t just that people have a hard time; but it means that people actually don’t have a life at all. And I think that’s the big, big, big challenge. So therefore issues like global warming will affect those people . . . You know when there are floods, it’s the poor people who suffer most. Even when you got the disaster in New Orleans, it was the poor people who suffered most. It’s always the case that the poorest are the people who suffer most because they don’t have the resources, the dwellings, the ability to meet what can be what are manmade or natural disasters.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: Well the big issue which doesn’t actually get the focus that it requires are issues of global poverty in the developing world. I mean there are still babies dying of diarrhea. And even the length of time that it takes us to do this interview, you know, maybe 10,000 babies will have died from curable diseases. So you know the . . . the news media has been dumbed down in many ways and things with celebrity and _________trivial or superficial. Matters are maybe because it’s . . . it’s a bird which needs to be fed. There’s so much media that deals with big atrocities or conflict situations. But beneath all of that . . . beneath all of that are issues which I firmly believe that people knew . . . that people knew ________ diarrhea can be cured for two cents . . . two cents. A small ________ of salt and sugar will stop a child from dying of diarrhea. If people knew that they would do something about it.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: You see these are all matters of political will. Wars don’t happen by accident any more than poverty happens by accident. They’re all curable. They’re all preventable. Now you know there are big interests being served by these conflicts. So it means standing up to the big interests. That means mobilizing, in many ways, public opinion. It means media playing a crucially important role of highlighting, and informing, and educating people in as objective a way as possible. But yes, there can be. In any given situation, there can be a just and a proper settlement, which means compromise; which means putting yourself in your opponents’ position. And you if you want proof of that, the proof does lie in Ireland to a certain extent. Here we have ________ and Mark McGinnis – co-managing equal partners in a power-sharing arrangement. We used to have the USSR along with __________. We . . . we used to have a Cold War. __________. There aren’t any certainties once . . . once shifts appear. One of the things I learned, and I believe with great conviction is that people respond to the political conditions in which they live. So if you want to change how people respond or think, change their conditions. Don’t try to attack their core values or . . . I mean you can obviously have your own view of it and you can argue the case. But fundamentalism from whatever position, I think, is essentially wrong if it’s in some way used to inflict repression or injustice upon other people. So if you want to change how human beings respond, then change the political conditions in which they live.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: No I don’t . . . I don’t put myself in any sort of position of comparing myself with anyone else. We . . . we help in a modest way. I have been to the Middle East. I spoke just last month to the Israeli ambassador to Britain. Mark McGinnis was in Sri Lanka and tried to help there. He also ________ with Ralph Meyer from South Africa a conference in Helsinki last month with people from Iraq. I’ve been fairly heavily involved in what’s now a field process, or at least a process which has been abandoned for some time. And the Spanish _________ dispute. So in a very modest way we can help. We . . . we help, but you can’t intrude. You can’t interfere. And there’s also, believe it or not, a whole industry as built up around conflict resolution. Some of it may be well meaning. Some of it may be less well meaning – self-perpetuating to a certain extent. I know from my own experience that there was nothing worse than do-gooders who come in and thought they had all the answers, and who come in with only a superficial knowledge of what was . . . was required. So if we can help in any of these processes, we will. But the calculation will be that we can be of benefit, and that we can . . . that we can advance negotiated settlements as a means of resolving conflicts. If people of Israel cannot ________ they want to – whatever the government and the military people may think – cannot wipe out the people of Palestine. And the people of Palestine cannot wipe out the people of Israel. So there has to be a negotiated approach. You know what I . . . Without appearing too long winded or folksy, if there’s a dispute in your family and you don’t talk, and you know then people get alienated; and then people take up fixed positions, and then other people get involved . . . But if somebody comes in and says, “Hi. Come here. You know that’s your brother. That’s your sister. That’s your husband. That’s your wife. That’s your children. Sit down and talk about it. Listen to what they have to say.”

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: Yes. In theory, yes. But I think first of all we should remind ourselves that against the background in India, there was quite a sustained campaign of violence against the British. But we didn’t have a Gandhi figure. We didn’t have such a figure. We didn’t have a Bishop Tutu. We didn’t have a Martin Luther King. _________ people who did proclaim the good news. The fact is the history of Ireland is one in which the physical force tradition is quite strong. And secondly, at a time of what’s called trouble or troubles, the military response has almost been the first reaction by the British stint. So why there was an ____ struggle; why there was economic struggle; or social emancipation; or why that was independence or liberation struggle, the British tracked down quite viciously. And given the Irish psyche and given our own history, the physical force tendency was always in the . . . in the _______. So you know as you get older you reflect on things and you see things from life experience and from a different perspective. I do think that armed actions were – and I defended them at the time – were justifiable in the context in which they occurred. I don’t _______. In fact I strongly disagree and disapprove of some of the things that happened. But I think the core of what we put together in this process was to develop an alternative to armed action. So it wasn’t a matter of condemning, or denouncing, or marginalizing the people who used physical force. It was a matter of saying, “Look. You don’t have to do that because here’s a different way to do it.” But that meant other pillars of society, including governments, ________ the international community taking their weight of the responsibility and showing that politics could actually work. Because up until that point politics actually worked.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Question: What was your hope for Northern Ireland?

Transcript: Well even _________ I don’t use the term Northern Ireland. It was interesting that even yet, I’ve never felt a oneness with the place. I’ve always been conscious of _________. And in fact they depended upon these conditions to keep them in a position of _________. It was only as you started to work your way through all of that that you realized it wasn’t just a simple task; that this was a journey. __________ it’s a life journey. You know had the unionists ______ reformed, arguably we would be living in a united Northern Ireland today now some almost 40 years later. But certainly there would not have been a conflict. There would not have been the war that we’ve all came through. As it turned out, the unionists did resist it. The reforms which were necessary crack down on what was a very pacifistic _________. It was based upon the American civil rights movement. We even used the same anthem of “We Shall Overcome”. The British state upheld the unionist position. The British government . . . the Labor government at that time brought troops in to uphold the position, to hold the _________. And within a few short years it was back to what Irish history has known for all of our existence. It was back to conflict between the government or the army of our nearest neighbor, Britain – on those in Ireland who want a republic, or who wanted Irish freedom, or who wanted ________.

Question: What was the turning point in the Northern Ireland peace process?

Transcript: Well it’s been a very long path. You know it’s . . . This reminds me of a very good friend of mine who is a really wonderfully well-known singer. And he was discovered after 30 years on the road. So I suppose the turning point of the Irish process was when we persuaded others of the value of dialogue and inclusivity. Once . . . once we got to that point, even though it maybe took us 20 more years to get to where we are now, dialogue is crucial. Political will is crucial. But inclusivity is just absolutely fundamental to our process.

Question: Looking back, would you have done anything differently?

Transcript: Well it’s hard to know. I used to bother myself with that question – you know why couldn’t we have done 30 years ago what we did 10 years ago? Why couldn’t . . . ____ look at the years 2004 to 2007, and it’s . . . it’s a collection of pieces I wrote as events were developing or immediately after events had occurred. So even from my own point of view, it was interesting to look at what I’d written at the time. So if you . . . if you have political will to make . . . to make something happen, it’s a matter then of getting other people who may have a ______ view . . . who may have the total opposite point of view into the same . . . the same frame. So a lot of . . . a lot of the work is really, really tedious. It’s really detailed. It’s away from . . . It’s away from the public . . . the public search light. And to tell you the truth for most people it’s probably boring. And maybe that’s what history is like – you know when you read the history book and something is reduced to one chapter or one paragraph. So in . . . in all of this, I mean if I could put on my hat depending on where you want to start, if the British had never come to Ireland the way that they did, we would never have had a conflict. The question reminds me of an old Irish joke about a tourist stopping a person on the road and asking them how would they get to Carey. And the person they stopped said, “Well if I was going to Carey, I wouldn’t start from here.” So it’s impossible to know what could have been done differently. I’m a bit more philosophical about it now. It would have been better if this had been sorted out a long time ago. It would have been better if people hadn’t of been killed. But I do think there is, as Shakespeare said, a tide in the affairs of men. So it took a John Hume; it took a Tony Blair; it took a Bill Clinton and on __________, I suppose. The efforts just didn’t work.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript:  I failed an exam which was called the Eleven Plus. But then ________ again the following year, so I ended up at grammar school.  And I suppose . . . I suppose I would have ended up teaching.  But I got caught up in the convulsion that became a conflict.  In 1964 in ________ leads the _________ arrangements throughout . . . during an election to come on to the Falls Road and take down the national flag, the Irish tri-color.  And the IUC when they received death threats, obliged him and went and took it down.  And of course it was then a matter of honor, I suppose, for the people to put it back up again.  So there was another ________ into the area and then it was taken down again.  I was going to school, and we passed the site where the flag was flown which was an election office.  And this was very exciting for us.  We went back and forth to school, and there were a huge amount of armed police officers, armored cars.  There was street violence for a few days.  And that sort of whetted my appetite.  I started to read in more . . . a more political way.  I started to try to figure out why things were not   . . .  Nineteen-sixty-six was the 50th anniversary of the 1916 Rising.  And that was marked with pageants, and with dramatic presentations, with republications of the writings of the leaders of _________ and Connelly, and others with poetry.  And just a . . . just a big celebration of this launch   . . . this watershed event in Irish history.  So I started to get a context then.  I started to read.  I became an Irish Republican as I started to read all of this.  And then I started . . . I joined __________.  I dropped out of school.  I became a founding member of the Civil Rights Association.  And there you have it.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Question: Who are you?

Transcript: My name is Gerry Adams.    I was born in Belfast last Friday 59 years ago. I was born into a very poor working class community in the Falls Road in West Belfast.  We didn’t know we were poor because everybody else was poor as well.  I was the eldest of what became a family of 10 children.  My mother actually was pregnant with 13 children and three died at birth of shortly afterwards.  And I was part of a wider family.  Both my mother and father came from large families as well.  And I can’t remember this of course, but we lived with my grammy.  Later on when I became older I went back to live with my grammy, which was quite a common occurrence.  And she was hugely influential on . . . on me.  And we lived, as many families did, with other members of the family.  And then for a short period in a tenement block in a place called Greencastle, which is on the shore of Belfast lock.  And then somewhere when I was five, or six, or seven, my mother succeeded in getting a house – a ________ house, public housing on the slopes of the Black Mountain – a place called _________.  And the whole family . . . the whole family lived there.  And in fact five or six of my brothers and sisters still live there. My mother, my grammy Adams, my father of course.  My uncle Paddy who I got to know who did a bit of writing, who was hugely tolerant, self-educated, was a ________ but read voraciously and was very knowledgeable.  And my family by the way – and I didn’t know this, and I’m still getting the extent of this as I get older myself – my family mostly on my mother’s side, my mother’s name was Holloway; and my father’s side were political families.  My paternal grandfather died quite early, but I never knew him.  But he had been a member of the _________ movement.  My father and a number of my uncles were imprisoned in the ‘30s into the ‘40s – as _______ prisoners.  On my mother’s side, her father was a Trade Union official.  He had been married twice.  His first wife was also a Trade Union official. In a local newspaper, they have a little column which looks at the past.  I think it’s called “Window into the Past” or “Remembering the Past”.  And one day I saw a little . . . the piece which was produced from the newspaper in 1921 or thereabouts.  And this book about a . . . a . . . this funeral for this woman who had been a Trade Union official and was my grandfather’s first wife.  And I remember my aunt, her daughter, who was _________, saying, “Why didn’t anyone tell me about my mommy?” I just thought it was really evocative of how ________ of history, and how her . . . this woman . . . the small piece _________ funeral and her . . . her ________ championed, particularly women’s causes within, you know . . .  Women weren’t organized within the labor movement at that time.  So I just thought that was . . . that was evocative and also illustrative of how women are ________ history.  But my . . . my . . . my . . . her husband who __________ her sister, actually, was a supporter of ________ and works with James Connelly who were both leaders of the Irish struggle.  James Connelly was a _______ leader that was executed by the British in 1916.  So as I say I only . . .  _________ still pick up bits and pieces of family history.  I wasn’t reared in a very political atmosphere.  At that time, I suppose, in the ‘50s . . . northern . . . I suppose people who would be Republicans or nationalists kept their heads down.  There was a lot of poverty as I said, immigration, bad housing, discrimination.  It was very much ________ sectarian place.  So I was ______ Irish ambience.  It was a little bit of Irish spoken around the house.  And my . . . my grammy was also a great reader, and she used to bring me to the public library, the Carnegie Library, on the Falls Road and introduced me to reading.  _______.  I’m the only one . . .  I’m the only member of my family who wears spectacles because I used to read . . . ________ read by the light of the street lamp which was outside . . . outside the door.

Recorded on: 10/8/07

Transcript: Well from my perspective, I mean the big force has been the forces of imperialism. You know wherever it's on the one hand the Holocaust; on the other hand, just the genocide of people, indigenous people everywhere. You know ________ look at the map of Africa, all the prominence between the states and state lines. Look at Iraq. So Iraq or even the Middle East, all the legacy of colonialism and imperialism. So I . . . That's . . . that's not a very considerate or educated ________. ______ drawing from my own experience of my own place where I live. But I think . . . I think that's what shaped in a negative sense.

Recorded On:10/8/07

Recorded On:10/9/2007

Recorded On:10/8/07